[TUHS] Comments on "C"

[Blake McBride]

After about 30 years of C, there are only three things I would have liked
to see:

1.  Computed goto

2.  goto a line in a different function (more than setjmp/longjmp)

3.  Easy / standard access to registers

Computed goto's are good for interpreters.

Goto a line in a different function makes it easier to implement languages
with tail recursion without a trampoline.  (Or perhaps require C to support
tail recursion.)

Some sort of standard way to access registers makes it easier to implement
garbage collectors without resorting to assembler.

Blake McBride


On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 7:42 PM, Larry McVoy <lm at mcvoy.com> wrote:

> I'm with Marc.  I think the C syntax is really pleasant, and while I
> enjoyed
> writing PDP-11 assembler (by far my favorite out the ones I've done which
> include VAX, m68k, 32032, z80, sparc, some x86 but not much), I don't want
> go back to writing assembler unless I have to.  C is a pleasant language
> that easily compiles to assembler.
>
> I happen to like it so much I made a scripting language that looks very
> C like, with some perl pleasantness tossed in (without all the dollar
> signs).  Check it out at
>
> http://www.little-lang.org
>
> 100% open source, actively developed, yada, yada.
>
> On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 06:37:21PM -0600, Marc Rochkind wrote:
> > Yeah, OK, another one of those clever glib UNIXy aphorisms.
> >
> > But, as anyone who's actually programmed seriously in assembly language
> > knows, C is not assembler. It is a system programming language low enough
> > to be used for things that were once done in assembler, the most
> important
> > of which is an OS.
> >
> > So, for most of us, we no longer had to write in assembler. But that
> > doesn't mean C is assembler.
> >
> > So, are we just having fun over a few beers, or talking seriously? I like
> > both!
> >
> > --Marc Rochkind
> >
> > On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 12:21 PM, Dave Horsfall <dave at horsfall.org>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Seen on another list...  And I got quoted by Steve Bellovin :-)
> > >
> > > --
> > > Dave Horsfall DTM (VK2KFU)  "Those who don't understand security will
> > > suffer."
> > >
> > > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > > From: Kent Borg
> > > To: cryptography at metzdowd.com
> > > Subject: Re: [Cryptography]
> > >     "NSA-linked Cisco exploit poses bigger threat than previously
> thought"
> > >
> > > On 08/25/2016 06:06 PM, Steven M. Bellovin wrote:
> > >
> > > > I first heard more or less that line from Doug McIlroy himself; he
> > > > called C the best assembler language he'd ever used.
> > >
> > > Ancient fun-fact: Years ago there was an article in Byte magazine
> > > describing how a useful subset of C could be directly assembled into
> 68000
> > > code. Not compiled, assembled.
> > >
> > > C is a stunning assembly language. When those wild-eyed nerds at AT&T
> > > decided to write Unix not in assembly but in C (where was
> management!?),
> > > it was radical. But C was up to (down to?) the task, it was pioneering
> > > then and is still doing useful things decades later: From the fastest
> > > supercomputers to some pretty slim microcontrollers (plus a hell of a
> lot
> > > of Android devices) multitudes of computers run a Linux kernel compiled
> > > from the *same* C source code, with almost no assembly. Big-endian,
> > > little-endian: no matter. Different word lengths: no matter.
> > >
> > > That is one impressive cross-platform assembly language!
> > >
> > > Unfortunately, C is also a dangerous language that mortal programmers
> > > cannot reliably wield.
> > >
> > > -kb, the Kent who knows he is pressing his luck on a moderated
> > > cryptography mailing list, but C deserves a lot of respect, as it also
> > > deserves to be efficiently sent into a dignified retirement.
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > The cryptography mailing list
> > > cryptography at metzdowd.com
> > > http://www.metzdowd.com/mailman/listinfo/cryptography
> > >
> > >
>
> --
> ---
> Larry McVoy                  lm at mcvoy.com
> http://www.mcvoy.com/lm
>
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