TUHS

tuhs@tuhs.org

47 participants
6502 discussions

by Paul Ruizendaal

I rather enjoyed having the “unix50.org” website around: very handy to test out bits and pieces of Unix history. It seems to have been taken down. Would it make sense to have this resource available permanently?

5 years, 3 months

Re: [TUHS] V9 shell [was Re: Warner's Early Unix Presentation]

by Doug McIlroy

> What i like is the autocorrect feature in v8: > > $ cd /usr/blot > /usr/blit > $ pwd > /usr/blit Here I am, editor of the v8 manual and unaware of the feature. We now know that silent correction is a terrible idea. Postel's principle: "be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others" was doctrine in early HTML specs, and led to disastrous disagreement among browsers' interpretation of web pages. Sadly, the "principle" lives on despite its having been expunged from the HTML spec. Today's "langsec" movement grew out of bitter experience with malicious inputs exploiting "liberal" interpretation of nonconforming data. Today's NYT has an article about fake knockoffs of George Orwell for sale on Amazon. It cites an edition of "Animal Farm" apparently pirated by lowgrade OCR autocorrected and never proofread. One of the many gaffes is that every instance of "iv" beame ChapterIV, as in "prChapterIVacy". I didn't like some Lisp systems' DWIM (do what I mean) when I first heard about the feature, and I like it even less 40-some years on. I would probably have remonstrated with Rob had I realized the shell was doing it. Doug

5 years, 3 months

compiling v9sh

by arnold＠skeeve.com

For anyone who's interested, here is what it took to compile Geoff Collyer's v9sh on Ubuntu 18.04. Arnold ---------------------------------- diff -ur v9sh/error.c v9sh-new/error.c --- v9sh/error.c 2017-07-29 11:45:07.000000000 +0300 +++ v9sh-new/error.c 2020-02-10 17:31:33.275920947 +0200 @@ -24,7 +24,7 @@ } if (per) { prs(colon); - prs(errno < 0 || errno >= sys_nerr? "Bad errno": sys_errlist[errno]); + prs(strerror(errno)); } newline(); exitsh(ERROR); diff -ur v9sh/pathserv.c v9sh-new/pathserv.c --- v9sh/pathserv.c 2017-07-29 12:06:25.000000000 +0300 +++ v9sh-new/pathserv.c 2020-02-10 17:29:43.666971083 +0200 @@ -30,7 +30,7 @@ { struct stat buf; - if (stat(name, &buf) == 0 && (buf.st_mode&S_IFMT) == S_IFREG && + if (stat(name, &buf) == 0 && S_ISREG(buf.st_mode) && access(name, EXECUTE) == 0) return 0; else diff -ur v9sh/xec.c v9sh-new/xec.c --- v9sh/xec.c 2017-07-29 12:27:02.000000000 +0300 +++ v9sh-new/xec.c 2020-02-10 17:29:50.607030967 +0200 @@ -612,7 +612,7 @@ if (flags&ttyflg && (dir1 = spname(tempdir, &score)) && stat(dir1, &sb) == 0 && - (sb.st_mode&S_IFMT) == S_IFDIR && + S_ISDIR(sb.st_mode) && access(dir1, EXECUTE) == 0) { /* dir1 is a searchable directory. */ if (score < bestscore) {

5 years, 3 months

Re: [TUHS] screen editors

by Thomas Paulsen

>What's funny is that in doing the work to get 'se' running on Georgia >Tech's Vax, I had to learn vi. By the time I was done, vi had become >my main editor and had burned itself into my finger's ROMs. I do ed/se occasionally for simple tasks, vim frequently , because it loads fast, and emacs for all bigger projects, beside liteide for golang.

5 years, 3 months

keyboards and command names

by Rich Morin

I have always suspected that the brevity of the Unix command names was strongly influenced by the clunky keyboards on the teletypes that were being used. Can anyone confirm, deny, and/or comment on this? -r

5 years, 3 months

Discord channels for COFF/TUHS

by Warren Toomey

All, Silent700 has graciously set up channels underneath the ClassicCMP Discord server for COFF and TUHS: COFF: https://discordapp.com/channels/642419539946110997/675860587355308049 TUHS: https://discordapp.com/channels/642419539946110997/675860622738718775 I thought it made sense to have the channels on a server where there was already old computer people (old for either or both :-). Cheers, Warren

5 years, 3 months

Re: [TUHS] Distributed systems, was: On the origins of Linux - "an academic question"

by Andrew Warkentin

On 1/17/20, Brantley Coile <brantley(a)coraid.com> wrote: > what he said. > >> On Jan 17, 2020, at 6:20 PM, Rob Pike <robpike(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Plan 9 is not a "single-system-image cluster". >> >> -rob >> > > I guess SSI isn't the right term for Plan 9 clustering since not everything is shared, although I would still say it has some aspects of SSI. I was talking about systems that try to make a cluster look like a single machine in some way even if they don't share everything (I'm not sure if there's a better term for such systems besides the rather vague "distributed" which could mean anything from full SSI to systems that allow transparent access to services/devices on other machines without trying to make a cluster look like a single system).

5 years, 3 months

Idea: a regular video chat

by Warren Toomey

[x-posting to COFF] Idea: anybody interested in a regular video chat? I was thinking of one that progresses(*) through three different timezones (Asia/Aus/NZ, then the Americas, then Europe/Africa) so that everybody should be able to get to two of the three timezones. (* like a progressive dinner) 30-60 minutes each one, general old computing. Perhaps a guest speaker now and then with a short presentation. Perhaps a theme now and then. Perhaps just chew the fat, shoot the breeze as well. Platform: Zoom or I'd be happy to set up a private Jitsi instance. Something else? How often: perhaps weekly or fortnightly through the three timezones, so it would cycle back every three or six weeks. Comments, suggestions?! Cheers, Warren

5 years, 3 months

Re: [TUHS] UNIBUS issues (Was: Spacewar at Bell Labs)

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Dave Horsfall <dave(a)horsfall.org> > [ Getting into COFF territory, I think ] I'm sending this reply to TUHS since the message I'm replying to has some errors, and I'd like for the corrections to be in the record close by. > On Thu, 30 Jan 2020, Clem Cole wrote: >> They way they tried to control it was to license the bus interface chips >> (made privately by Western Digital for them IIRC but were not available >> on the open market). Although DEC did have some custom chips for QBUS interfacing, they didn't always use them (below). And for the UNIBUS, the chips were always, AFAIK, open market (and the earliest ones may have predated the UNIBUS). E.g. the M105 Address Selector, a single-width FLIP CHIP, used in the earliest PDP-11's when devices such as the RK11-C, RP11 and TM11 were made out of a mass of small FLIP CHIPS, used SP380A's for its bus receivers and 8881's for transmitters. On the QBUS, the KDF11-A and KDJ11-A CPU cards used AMD 2908's as bus transceivers, even though DEC had its own custom chips. The KDF11-A also used DS8640's and DS8641's (transmitters and receivers), and also an 8881! (The UNIBUS and QBUS were effectively identical at the analog level, which is why a chip that historical was still in use.) >> If I recall it was the analog characteristics that were tricky with >> something like the BUS acquisition for DMA and Memory timing, but I >> admit I've forgotten the details. One _possibility_ for what he was talking about was that it took DEC a while to get a race/metastability issue with daisy-chained bus grant lines under control. (The issue is explained in some detail here: https://gunkies.org/wiki/Bus_Arbitration_on_the_Unibus_and_QBUS and linked pages.) This can been seen in the myriad of etch revisions for the M782 and related 'bus grant' FLIP CHIPs: https://gunkies.org/wiki/M782_Interrupt_Control By comparison, the M105 only had 3 through it's whole life! It wasn't until the M7821 etch D revision, which came out in 1977, almost a decade after the first PDP-11's appeared, that they seemed to have absorbed that the only 'solution' to the race/metastability issue involved adding delays. In all fairness, the entire field didn't really appreciate the metastability issue until the LINC guys at WUSTL did a big investigation of it, and then started a big campaign to educate everyone about it - it wasn't DEC being particularly clueless. > Hey, if the DEC marketoids didn't want 3rd-party UNIBUS implementations > then why was it published? Well, exactly - but it's useful to remember the differening situation for DEC from 1970 (first PDP-11's) and later. In 1970 DEC was mostly selling to scientists/engineers, who wanted to hook up to some lab equipment they'd built, and OEM's, who often wanted to use a mini to control some value-added gear of their own devising. An open bus was really necessary for those markets. Which is why the 1970 PDP-11/20 manual goes into a lot of detail on how to interface to the PDP-11's UNIBUS. Later, of course, they were in a different business model. Noel

5 years, 3 months

Re: [TUHS] Screen editors

by Jose R. Valverde

Talking of editors... Once I learned Wordstar in old CP/M (before that it was mostly line editing), and then soon, other editors that supported the Wordstar key combinations, I got hooked on those. Joe is, to date, one of my favorites. On ancient UNIX, my editor of choice was 's' from Software Tools, its main advantage being that it didn't require curses. Then we got VMS and 'eve' and that took over for a while (though I never took advantage of all its power), mostly until I ported 's' and 'joe'. Then came X, and when nedit was released, I was hooked on it. It has been for decades almost the only one that could do block selection 'a la' RAND editor. I have been struggling to continue using it despite it lack of support for UTF, trying various projects spun off nedit, until I recently discovered xnedit, which is an update available on GitHub and is again all I need, with support for UTF8, some minor UI improvements and support for modern fonts. Now, I still use 's' for ancient Unix emulators, 'joe' for the command line and 'xnedit' for X. j -- Scientific Computing Service Solving all your computer needs for Scientific Research. http://bioportal.cnb.csic.es

5 years, 3 months

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