Re: 2.11BSD, non-split i/d issues

<As already mentioned in previous messages, I'm working on getting <2.9BSD onto a Pro 350. I'm using 2.9BSD as a starting point because <it claims to support machines without split i/d. The 350 uses the <F-11 chipset, which I have read does not support split i/d. The F11 does not do I&D split but does have user/system. <I would prefer to use 2.11BSD because I understand it's still actively <used, and not as buggy as 2.9. But everything I've read about 2.11BSD <says that it needs split i/d to run. Can anyone give me more detail <about this? Was support for machines without split i/d removed from <the kernel, or is it just that some of the programs are too big to fit <in a single 64k segment? It's my understanding that 2.11 will run on F11 systems (pro350 and 11/23) if properly configured but the only binaries loose are for split I&D. So if properly configured you can get 2.11 to utilize the user/system spaces. Allison Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id MAA15404 for pups-liszt; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:32:52 +1100 (EST) Received: from moe.2bsd.com (0(a)MOE.2BSD.COM [206.139.202.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA15399 for &lt;pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au&gt;au>; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:32:38 +1100 (EST) Received: (from sms@localhost) by moe.2bsd.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) id RAA05895 for pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 17 Feb 1999 17:25:53 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 17:25:53 -0800 (PST) From: "Steven M. Schultz" &lt;sms(a)moe.2bsd.com&gt; Message-Id: &lt;199902180125.RAA05895(a)moe.2bsd.com&gt; To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: 2.11BSD, non-split i/d issues Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk Hi - Correct. Some systems also have an 18bit only MMU which restricts memory to 248kb max (others have a 22bit MMU and can physically have more memory). Not likely. The kernel won't fit in 48kb that I know of. And there will be no networking support since that requires supervisor mode which non-split I/D systems don't have. The skeleton of a Makefile for non-split a kernel exists but it will take much work (it is essentially just a list of file that may or may not be 100% current) to kick into shape. Also, remember that programs like 'csh', 'vi' and so on are not only split I/D but overlaid - they will not run on a non-split machine. Steven Schultz Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id MAA15443 for pups-liszt; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:44:04 +1100 (EST) Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca (kcwellsc(a)math.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.216.42]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA15438 for &lt;pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au&gt;au>; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:43:48 +1100 (EST) Received: (from kcwellsc@localhost) by math.uwaterloo.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA01509; Wed, 17 Feb 1999 20:43:28 -0500 (EST) From: Ken Wellsch &lt;kcwellsc(a)math.uwaterloo.ca&gt; Message-Id: &lt;199902180143.UAA01509(a)math.uwaterloo.ca&gt; Subject: Re: Venix (was Re: 2.9BSD: mbuf.h) To: djenner(a)halcyon.com Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 20:43:27 -0500 (EST) Cc: entropy(a)zippy.bernstein.com, pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: &lt;36CAEA1F.D5D7C838(a)halcyon.com&gt; from "David C. Jenner" at Feb 17, 99 08:11:12 am Organization: University of Waterloo, Math Faculty Computing Facility (Alumni) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk | I don't have any docs on the DECNA, but they must exist. It's | probably pretty close to the DEQNA. The DECNA uses one of the earlier Intel network chips. It lives on the CTI bus, a bus like no other. I believe the DEQNA is T-11 based and lives on the vastly better known Q-bus... -- Ken Received: (from major@localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) id FAA18371 for pups-liszt; Fri, 19 Feb 1999 05:47:10 +1100 (EST) Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca (kcwellsc(a)math.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.216.42]) by minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id FAA18366 for &lt;pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au&gt;au>; Fri, 19 Feb 1999 05:46:55 +1100 (EST) Received: (from kcwellsc@localhost) by math.uwaterloo.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA05766; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:46:36 -0500 (EST) From: Ken Wellsch &lt;kcwellsc(a)math.uwaterloo.ca&gt; Message-Id: &lt;199902181846.NAA05766(a)math.uwaterloo.ca&gt; Subject: Re: Venix (was Re: 2.9BSD: mbuf.h) To: simul8(a)simul8.demon.co.uk (James Lothian) Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:46:35 -0500 (EST) Cc: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <01BE5B64.56247680@SONAR> from "James Lothian" at Feb 18, 99 01:14:51 pm Organization: University of Waterloo, Math Faculty Computing Facility (Alumni) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.edu.au Precedence: bulk I'm going to give up as I seem to remember nothing anymore... sigh. Allison also sent e-mail saying the DEQNA is not T-11 based. I guess I'm thinking of an RQDX3. I've had no place to unpack my old iron in over three years and certainly miss being able to pick up the part in question before foaming at the mouth spouting nonsense. Many apologies for suggesting such major inaccuracies. -- Ken P.S. Allison describe the DEQNA as a state-driven device with PALs (I think) and that "big F" may the the gate array also mentioned. | From simul8(a)simul8.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 18 12:27:23 1999 | | Just for the sake of being picky... the DEQNA is based on an Intel | microcontroller chip (something 8085-ish, I think). The ethernet chipset | seems to be Fairchild (it's certainly got a big F on it.) | | James