<See the petition hyperlinked on http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/
I've done the petition.
<Hopefully (soon) you will be able to buy one from SCO for about US$100.
<You can get the binaries for v6 and v7, see Bob Supnik's PDP-11 emulator
<on the same web page.
I also know of the binaries for v6 and v7 at several sites for emulator use.
What is unclear is how to get those binaries onto a real PDP-11 such as my
11/73 and if the devices I have are even supported.
Allison
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>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Thu Sep 11 14:49:53 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199709110449.OAA17004(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: UNIX for PDP-11: moving on to media
To: allisonp(a)world.std.com (Allison J Parent)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:49:53 +1000 (EST)
Cc: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
In-Reply-To: <199709110441.AA09464(a)world.std.com> from Allison J Parent at "Sep 11, 97 00:41:08 am"
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In article by Allison J Parent:
>
> <See the petition hyperlinked on http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/
>
> I've done the petition.
>
> <Hopefully (soon) you will be able to buy one from SCO for about US$100.
> <You can get the binaries for v6 and v7, see Bob Supnik's PDP-11 emulator
> <on the same web page.
>
> I also know of the binaries for v6 and v7 at several sites for emulator use.
>
> What is unclear is how to get those binaries onto a real PDP-11 such as my
> 11/73 and if the devices I have are even supported.
Sorry for the misunderstanding Allison!
Actually, that's a very good question. As I'm not a hardware person, I'll
pass this over to the other PUPS mailing list members. If/when SCO start
selling licenses & we make CD-ROMs or FTP sites available, this question
is going to come up an awful lot:
Question 1
----------
How do I get a Unix distribution onto:
- a tape, because I have a tape drive
- a disk drive, as I don't have a tape drive
assuming I [ have RT-11/ RSX / no operating system ] on the PDP-11 already.
Question 2
----------
I have [ this particular CPU and this list of other peripherals ].
What version(s) of Unix can I run on this PDP-11?
Can anybody help out with answers to Question 1? Bits & pieces of Question 2
are answered on the PUPS web pages, but they need expanding.
Thanks in advance for any information, and any programs (boot code etc)
that I can add in to the PUPS archive!!
Warren
Hello,
Curiousity, How does one get a license for a PDP-11 version of unix these
days? I've had an 11/73 I've been itching to run unix on.
Allison
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[Robert has got a copy of System II for PDP-11 on tapes]
> If I had a way to copy the tapes, I would have no problem and i'm not
> even sure what is exactly on the tapes or if they are still good as I've
> never really used them as the Unix III was already loaded on disks when I
> got them PDP-11/34 from Bell Labs.
>
> (The sytem was used here in Bell Labs here in Indianapolis, IN to help
> develope the first speech recognition system and I still have most of
> the software "somehwere" on RL01/02 packs, so I'm kinda attached to the
> tapes.)
>
> And, I have a gentleman here that is going to come pick up all my PDP
> stuff in the next month or so for a computer museum he is putting together.
>
> So, if you can copy the tapes, I might be talked in to releasing the
> tapes to you for copying for a good cause.
Robert, I forgot to cc my reply to the others on the PUPS mailing list.
Would anybody in the US be able to look at Robert's tapes to see if we
can recover System III? John Holden just donated System V to the PUPS
archive, so System III would also be a good addition.
Please email to Robert & the mailing list if you are willing to look at
the tapes.
Thanks in advance,
Warren
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I've set up a searchable archive of the mail from the PDP-11 Unix
mailing list, at
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/cgi-bin/pups.cgi
Let me know of any problems with it. Updates to the archive will be done
manually until I iron out some script bugs!
Warren
Warren wrote:
: If you don't have RK05 or RL02s, someone should be able to build
: a suitable disk image for you. I think you'll need to go 6th Edition
: as you have a /23.
7th Edition runs fine on an 11/23 or 11/34, providing you build the
'small machine' version. I've had 7th on my 11/23 with 256K and 2xRL02 for
years.
Pete
>From Kevin Wright <Kevin.Wright(a)VITREX.com> Tue Sep 2 11:25:46 1997
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From: Kevin Wright <Kevin.Wright(a)VITREX.com>
To: "'wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au'" <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: PDP-11 hardware liquidation
Date: Mon, 1 Sep 1997 19:25:46 -0600
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1-SEP-97
As owner of a PDP-11/23+ system, I know how difficult it can be to find
hardware for older PDP-11's.
I'd like to inform you that I've found a terrific source in Utah for
used DEC hardware including PDP-11 related items. This person has a
2400 sq ft warehouse (about 3 semi truck loads) quite literally brimming
with computer hardware which has been collected and stored over the past
10 years. He is currently in the process of liquidating it at very,
very low prices. Tons of miscellaneous computer equipment is available,
much of which was manufactured by DEC. It would be impossible to list
even a fraction of what he has available, but he has told me that his
inventory includes approximately 1000 Q-Bus and Unibus boards, plus
peripheral devices such as disk and tape drives. I've not been to the
warehouse in person yet , but I will be visiting the site in about 2
weeks time from now.
If interested, you should be aware that he is in the process of getting
rid of EVERYTHING! It sounds like it will all be gone in the next 3 to
4 weeks.
Opportunities like this very seldom come along, so please contact me via
email if you are interested in finding out more. I'll be happy to
forward to you, any needed information that I can.
Please feel free to forward this notice to anyone you think might be
interested.
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>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Sep 3 16:23:06 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199709030623.QAA07853(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: PUPS Mailing List - Now Majordomo
To: pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 16:23:06 +1000 (EST)
Cc: wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
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All,
I've just moved the PUPS (old PDP-11 Unix) mailing list over
to run under MajorDomo. I'm still learning MajorDomo, so there might be
some teething troubles.
The new list is called:
pups(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Can you update any aliases that point to this list. I will keep the original
/etc/aliases mailing list oldunix(a)cs.adfa.oz.au around for a while
until I'm sure the new one works fine.
As with MajorDomo, you can send messages to get off the mailing list.
Please let me know of any problems.
Updates: SCO Petition, CD-R writers etc.
----------------------------------------
Ok, we're still chatting with SCO. I got a summary of internal mail which
shows that there are 2 sides in SCO, those who think it's a good idea (PR-wise
at least) and those who can't see the point & who think it's a can of worms.
I feel that the people on our side are winning. I've been trying to explain
the history of some of the UNIX flavours to their legal eagle, who must know
recent history only. I think we can iron things out.
Several people from Europe & the US said that they had access to a CD-R
writer, & could write CDs, if that became the distribution method for
passing on the PUPS archive.
I will probably go buy a new X-Gig disk to give the archive a proper FTP
home. I've come up with a new archive layout & will pass it on to you all
for comments. Anyway, it looks like progress is being made & we should be
able to buy personal UNIX licenses soon :-).
More updates to the list as things happen. Thanks for your suport!!
Warren wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
In article by Mark D. Roth:
> Warren,
>
> I have a PDP-11/03-L at home that I rescued from Bell+Howell Corp and
> know next to nothing about. I'm looking for any info I might be able
> to find on how to get this machine running, as well as any info I
> might find about getting a Unix implementation for it.
I don't think you'll get Unix running on an /03, I just searched thru the
paper archives here and I've seen references to /23's, /34's, 40's on up,
but not for /03's. I'd suspect that the /03 doesn't have the memory management
(nor the memory) to get Unix running.
> I saw reference to a mailing list on the webpage, but no information
> on how to join. What can you tell me?
Mark, I'll add you to the list, and bounce this there as well; someone
with more knowledge of -11 hardware should be able to set us both straight
with regards to 11/03's.
Cheers,
Warren
>From "Steven M. Schultz" <sms(a)moe.2bsd.com> Mon Aug 11 13:53:16 1997
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From: "Steven M. Schultz" <sms(a)moe.2bsd.com>
Message-Id: <199708110353.UAA21891(a)moe.2bsd.com>
To: roth(a)uiuc.edu, wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au
Subject: Re: PUPS
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Warren, Mark -
> In article by Mark D. Roth:
> > I have a PDP-11/03-L at home that I rescued from Bell+Howell Corp and
> > know next to nothing about. I'm looking for any info I might be able
>
> I don't think you'll get Unix running on an /03, I just searched thru the
Quite correct.
> paper archives here and I've seen references to /23's, /34's, 40's on up,
> but not for /03's. I'd suspect that the /03 doesn't have the memory management
> (nor the memory) to get Unix running.
Warren - you're absolutely right. The 11/03 has a maximum memory
(most were not fully populated) of 56kbytes and _no_ memory
management. Any Unix (since the initial one on the PDP-7) requires
at least two memory management states: kernel and user. Much later
versions can take advantage of the 3rd mode (supervisor).
Smallest machine I ever ran Unix on was an 11/23 (the development
was done on a 11/70 because various programs were too large to run
on a non split I/D machine such as the 11/23) and it was, shall we
say, "interesting". Just enough memory (max of 248kb) to run one or
two user processes at a time (we had a rather large kernel and some
homebrew communications drivers) - you could get logged in and then
each time you typed a command the shell would get swapped out to run
your command ;).
> Mark, I'll add you to the list, and bounce this there as well; someone
> with more knowledge of -11 hardware should be able to set us both straight
> with regards to 11/03's.
You got it right - nothing to set straight.
Steven Schultz
>From George Coulouris <George.Coulouris(a)dcs.qmw.ac.uk> Fri Aug 22 01:49:53 1997
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References: <199708062322.JAA03135(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> from "Warren
Toomey" at Aug 7, 97 09:22:07 am
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Date: Thu, 21 Aug 1997 16:49:53 +0100
To: Michael Engel <engel(a)numerik.math.uni-siegen.de>
From: George Coulouris <George.Coulouris(a)dcs.qmw.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: George's PDP Tape in UK
Cc: Tim Bradshaw <tfb(a)aiai.ed.ac.uk>, wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey),
oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Dear Michael,
Many thanks for your offer. Sorry for the delay in replying. If you are
still willing I would like to take up your offer. If you will mail me your
physical mail address, I'll send you the tape. As far as I can remember the
tape is a UNIX tar archive, that should be readable on the VMS machine and
you could give the files back to me by ftp.
(I'm taking up your offer rather than Tim Bradshaw's because you seem to
have had more recent success with reading old tapes.
Thanks again,
George
At 9:39 am +0100 7/8/97, Michael Engel wrote:
* >
* We have a TU81+ 9 track tape connected to a VMS Alpha here. So, if you send
* me the tape, I will try to read it. Worked perfectly some months ago for a
* 10 yr. old tape from a DECsystem 10 ...
*
At 3:22 pm +0100 7/8/97, Tim Bradshaw wrote:
*
* We have old-tape-reading-technology, so we could give it a try. No
* promises at all though (I have to turn the drive back on &c, and it's
* not altogether clear that it will work, though it did last time I
* tried it), asnd it will take me ages to get around to it, being very
* inefficient...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
George F. Coulouris | Computer Science Dept
Professor of Computer Systems | QMW, University of London
WWW: http://www.dcs.qmw.ac.uk/~george | Mile End Road
Phone: +44 171 975 5201 (direct line) | London E1 4NS
Fax: +44 181 980 6533 | United Kingdom
Home phone: +44 171 485 5896 |
pager: 01426 183113 |
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Aug 27 10:45:58 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708270045.KAA03801(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Latest PDP-11 UNIX email from SCO
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:45:58 +1000 (EST)
Reply-To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
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All,
Here is the latest email from SCO with regards to PDP-11 UNIX
source licenses. I'll add one comment at the bottom.
Please treat this as YOUR EYES ONLY. I haven't got permission from Dion
to forward this on (yet), but I think that more pairs of eyes than just
mine need to have a look at it for any problems.
----- Forwarded message from Dion -----
From: Dion <dionj(a)sco.COM>
X-Mailer: SCO OpenServer Mail Release 5.0
To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
Subject: Re: Touching Base!
Date: Tue, 26 Aug 97 12:45:07 PDT
Warren,
Good progress. We have some positive consensus developing.
Here is the proposed license terms (roughly, not fully legalized
yet). Please let me know if you see any problems with this
proposal:
Here are the terms that I think make sense:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
License terms:
* the license covers the entire distributions (source code, binaries and
documentation) of the following versions of UNIX:
o 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th Edition UNIX
o 32V UNIX
o PWB/UNIX
o those portions of all 2BSD releases which are derived from UNIX
source code
* licensees have these rights wrt the binaries and source code of the above
versions of UNIX:
use
store
reproduce
edit
adapt
enchance
improve
otherwise modify
transmit electronically
repackage
* These rights are licensed to noncommercial users. The source may
not be sold nor used to develop commercial versions of UNIX.
* licensees have the right to install UNIX binaries on PDP-11 hardware and
PDP-11 emulating software
* licensees have the right to allow noncommercial use the UNIX binaries on
systems for which the product is licensed.
(Note that the latter is already permitted, given SCO's binary license
agreement for 5th, 6th and 7th Edition UNIX. We would also be happy with the
following conditions imposed in the source code and binary license for
PDP-11 UNIXes)
* license is not transferable.
* source code covered by the license cannot be distributed or disclosed
to people not covered by the license. The licensees are permitted to
collaborate on modifications and mutually share their modifications.
* SCO is not required to provide copies of any source code, binaries or
documentation with the source code and binary license for PDP-11 UNIXes
License Fee: SCO charges a one-time license fee of $100 per licensee,
for a site license for one organization.
We may, at some future time, provide source distributions (if/when
we can find the sources), but this is not committed. We know that
the licensees have, between them, most of the needed sources.
----- End of forwarded message from Dion -----
My comment. The only thing I want to change is:
* licensees have the right to install UNIX binaries on PDP-11 hardware
and PDP-11 emulating software
becomes
* licensees have the right to install UNIX software on PDP-11 hardware
and PDP-11 emulating software
This allows us to install source so as to modify it or to rebuild kernels etc.
I briefly raised the issue of source distribution (SCO or me? FTP or CD-ROM?),
but I suggested that we leave it until the licenses go on sale.
Please email your comments on this to the mailing list
(oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au)
Thanks,
Warren wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Aug 27 15:51:20 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708270551.PAA00316(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: Latest PDP-11 UNIX email from SCO
To: sms(a)moe.2bsd.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:51:20 +1000 (EST)
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
In-Reply-To: <199708270539.WAA16297(a)moe.2bsd.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at "Aug 26, 97 10:39:11 pm"
Reply-To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
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In article by Steven M. Schultz:
> It looks to me that SCO has granted "us" every single thing we were
> asking for.
I've thought of a few more changes:
In the wording from SCO, the status of `documentation' is unclear. The
following should clear this up:
+ use the term software == `source, binaries and documentation' in many
places where this is appropriate.
+ use the term `source' only where they want to restrict to licensees.
+ also, don't disclose `source' to people not covered by the SCO license
or by existing UNIX software licenses from Western Electric and AT&T.
Comments anybody?
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Fri Aug 29 11:43:09 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708290143.LAA03340(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: Latest PDP-11 UNIX email from SCO
To: mcjones(a)pa.dec.com
Date: Fri, 29 Aug 1997 11:43:09 +1000 (EST)
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
In-Reply-To: <9708281506.AA29078(a)numbat05-an2.pa.dec.com> from "mcjones(a)pa.dec.com" at "Aug 28, 97 08:06:23 am"
Reply-To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
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In article by mcjones(a)pa.dec.com:
>
> > Maybe someone else can volunteer, if I organise the contents :-)
>
> There's one here at my workplace. I don't know how to use it myself.
> I could probably get some help in burning one or two, but I don't
> think it would be appropriate to burn dozens or hundreds. How many
> licensees do you anticipate?
There's 300 signatures on the petition. I'd hope that 1/2 of those
will buy licenses, and probably most would like the stuff in easy-to-use
form.
I know that Steven Schultz has access to a writer too (hint hint!).
I will probably buy another hard disk here for the PDP archive, and give
access to license holders.
I'd like to get users to suggest layout changes & what should be exploded
etc. so that we can burn a 650M CD image directly from the archive.
Currently, the archive is sitting at 250M, so there's room to explode
many of the distributions stored there.
We also need to sit down and catalogue this stuff so that it's not
just a collection of random tapes. I'm slowly doing this & have done
the most important stuff, see the Tapes/DETAILS file if you ftp in.
But more work needs to be done.
So hopefully, we can pass the archive (as a Rock Ridge image) to a few
volunteers to burn CD-R copies. Anybody in Europe who would volunteer?
Just an idea!
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Sun Aug 31 12:41:29 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708310241.MAA04803(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: PDP-11 Unix CD-ROM archive burn
To: Kevin.Wright(a)VITREX.com (Kevin Wright)
Date: Sun, 31 Aug 1997 12:41:29 +1000 (EST)
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
In-Reply-To: <B0620B9317B0D0119D3C0060976CE96418B8(a)nt-main.vitrex.com> from Kevin Wright at "Aug 29, 97 09:24:27 am"
Reply-To: wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
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In article by Kevin Wright:
> I could very possibly volunteer to do one. I have access to my
> companies cdrom burner.
>
> Subject change:
> I own a PDP-11/23+ for which I'm constantly searching the Internet for
> RT-11 and TSX+ documentation and software, as well as any other OS's
> such as Unix. Do you have any such software/documentation in your
> archive of which you would be willing to allow me a copy?
Kevin, until you can buy a license from SCO (soon I hope), all I can
offer are the binaries for 6th & 7th Edition. If you have an RK05 or RL02,
then you can get disk images as part of Bob Supnik's PDP-11 emulator,
at ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11-sims/Supnik_2.3
(or a similar URL, I'm typing from memory).
If you don't have RK05 or RL02s, someone should be able to build
a suitable disk image for you. I think you'll need to go 6th Edition
as you have a /23.
Warren
Mahlzeit
According to Warren Toomey:
> If I become the `central repository' for the software, then I'd like to
> set up access procedures which ensure that only legitimate users can access
> the archive, and that eavesdropping or hacking access to the archive
> shouldn't divulge its contents easily.
Isn't ftp for a $200-programm secure enough? I'm doing beta testing
for a programm, which costs $1100 and they distribute the passwords
for ftp by unencrypted mail. They do that allready for a few releases
and I don't think they had any problems with that.
> Keep the archive files encrypted:
>
> - This will stop hackers who penetrate the archive from getting the
> plaintext version of the files. I suggest using PGP with a very
> large key size to encrypt the files. The key won't be kept on the
> archive machine.
I don't think you need a very large key. Everyone, which has the
choice to crack a 512bit key or to pay $200, would choose to pay.
> I'd really like feedback from you about the proposed scheme for providing
> access to this old UNIX software!
I think pgp is to difficult to use for some. You could use a simple
encryption programm like: ftp://isidor.ethz.ch/pub/simpl/safer.V1.1.tar.Z
which should be very portable. The passphrase could be distributed on
the license.
Mahlzeit
endergone Zwiebeltuete
--
insanity inside
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Thu Aug 7 09:22:07 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708062322.JAA03135(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: George's PDP Tape in UK
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 09:22:07 +1000 (EST)
Cc: George.Coulouris(a)dcs.qmw.ac.uk
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Dear PDP-11 UNIXers,
Just got this back from George Coulouris in the UK. He's got an
old tape with PDP-11 UNIX software on it which he'd like to read:
* In article by George Coulouris:
* > Warren,
* > Thanks for your reply. I'd be happy to liase with anyone who is willing to
* > have a go at reading the tape.
* > George
*
[and later...]
* Did anybody get back to you about reading that old PDP-11 tape, George??
No, I'm afraid not.
I have been told that there is a 9-track tape drive at another centre in
London, but I haven't pursued it 'cos I was waiting for contact from your
people.
George
-------
Can anybody in the UK or Europe who would be happy to read this old tape for
George & for the PUPS archive please email him! His address is
George.Coulouris(a)dcs.qmw.ac.uk
Many thanks in advance,
Warren wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
>From Michael Engel <engel(a)numerik.math.uni-siegen.de> Thu Aug 7 18:39:42 1997
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Subject: Re: George's PDP Tape in UK
To: wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 10:39:42 +0200 (MET DST)
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au, George.Coulouris(a)dcs.qmw.ac.uk
In-Reply-To: <199708062322.JAA03135(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> from "Warren Toomey" at Aug 7, 97 09:22:07 am
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Hi,
it seems my mail didn`t come through last time ...
> Just got this back from George Coulouris in the UK. He's got an
> old tape with PDP-11 UNIX software on it which he'd like to read:
>
> * In article by George Coulouris:
> * > Warren,
> * > Thanks for your reply. I'd be happy to liase with anyone who is willing to
> * > have a go at reading the tape.
> * > George
>
> [and later...]
>
> * Did anybody get back to you about reading that old PDP-11 tape, George??
>
> No, I'm afraid not.
>
> I have been told that there is a 9-track tape drive at another centre in
> London, but I haven't pursued it 'cos I was waiting for contact from your
> people.
>
We have a TU81+ 9 track tape connected to a VMS Alpha here. So, if you send
me the tape, I will try to read it. Worked perfectly some months ago for a
10 yr. old tape from a DECsystem 10 ...
regards,
Michael Engel (engel(a)unix-ag.uni-siegen.de)
I have a micro11/73 with RX50 and RD53 drives. Is there a BSD variant
which I can run on the thing?
Regards,
Bob
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bob Manners (My REAL address is: rjm(a)swift.eng.ox.ac.uk)
BOB'S COMPUTER MUSEUM: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Fri Aug 1 13:19:52 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708010319.NAA10575(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Old UNIX ftp archive - access ideas
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Fri, 1 Aug 1997 13:19:52 +1000 (EST)
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Dear PDP-11 & old Unix enthusiasts,
Status report of our petition to SCO about UNIX src licenses. I received this
from Dion Johnson last week:
Warren,
Thanks for your latest news. That's great about the signatures.
Yes, I perused the earlier list and it's really amazing that
we have such famous support for this. I am sure it will be
a great PR victory when we finally get this arranged.
Our exec VP (Doug Michels) is on your side. I am annoying our
legal folks, bless their hearts. :-) They have a job to do also and
I want to be sure we are protecting SCO's interests in the code
in the right ways.
I expect an answer in a week or so. I suspect there will be
further internal iterations here as we craft a license that works
for all parties.
So the right answer to publish is:
"SCO is pleased to entertain this request from so many loyal and
famous fans of UNIX. We are looking into how we can provide this
source code. No promises at this time, since there are some
intellectual property issues that must be resolved, but we will
do what we can."
I'll email when I hear more. It occurred to me that if SCO agree to src
licenses and people buy them, then they will of course want the software.
I already make the stuff available to several people, on the trust that they
have existing src licenses (e.g show me the first 100 lines of v7 nami.c etc.)
At the moment, it's all sitting as .tar.gz files on my desktop box.
If I become the `central repository' for the software, then I'd like to
set up access procedures which ensure that only legitimate users can access
the archive, and that eavesdropping or hacking access to the archive
shouldn't divulge its contents easily.
I'm after comments from you guys, the end users of the archive, as to what
sounds good, ok, bad, annoying and/or plain stupid to you.
Proposal
--------
Make the archive available via FTP:
- To prevent capture of ftp passwords, I suggest that each license
owner has an ftp account, and authentication is done using S/Key.
To distribute the S/Key key phrase or a number of S/Key pass
phrases to the license owners, I suggest using PGP email.
Keep the archive files encrypted:
- This will stop hackers who penetrate the archive from getting the
plaintext version of the files. I suggest using PGP with a very
large key size to encrypt the files. The key won't be kept on the
archive machine.
Transmission to license owner - Suggestion A:
- Transmit the PGP encrypted files `as is' to the license owner
via ftp. Shortcoming: every license owner has the same private
key required to decrypt the files. A hacker only needs to find
one vulnerable license owner to get the key.
Transmission to license owner - Suggestion B:
- On-the-fly PGP encrypt the files using a key specific to the
license owner. Shortcoming: end user must have a personal key
plus the common key, and must decrypt everything twice.
Transmission to license owner - Suggestion C:
- On-the-fly decrypt the archive file, and on-the-fly re-encrypt
it using a key specific to the license owner. End user only needs
one personal PGP key to decrypt the file. Shortcoming: the key
required to decrypt the file back to plaintext must exist on the
archive server. Hackers who break-in can thus get plaintext.
I think I prefer Suggestion A. For all 3 suggestions above, PGP
private keys will be sent to license holders using PGP email.
Anyway, this is an off the cuff set of ideas. I certainly want to keep
my butt from being sued off by SCO :-), and so I need to authenticate users,
keep audit trails of downloads and logins, and take reasonable steps to
prevent non-legitimate users from accessing the licensed material.
I'd really like feedback from you about the proposed scheme for providing
access to this old UNIX software!
Thanks in advance,
Warren wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Fri Aug 1 14:02:29 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708010402.OAA10623(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: ideas re UNIX licensed distribution
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Fri, 1 Aug 1997 14:02:29 +1000 (EST)
In-Reply-To: <199708010345.UAA27393(a)generic.yamato.com> from "Robert J. Kelley" at "Jul 31, 97 08:45:03 pm"
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In article by Robert J. Kelley:
>
> Why not just use SSH: verified licensees could submit keys and
> the archive server would keep them on file. scp could be used
> to retrieve the files.
I'd still have to encrypt the archive files that are resident on disk.
Also, ssh is more of a `general' login account. scp would allow someone
to retrieve /etc/password :-)
If I could restrict scp access, that'd be an ok alternative.
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Fri Aug 1 14:33:26 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199708010433.OAA10684(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: Old UNIX ftp archive - access ideas
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Fri, 1 Aug 1997 14:33:26 +1000 (EST)
In-Reply-To: <199708010412.VAA15987(a)moe.2bsd.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at "Jul 31, 97 09:12:05 pm"
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In article by Steven M. Schultz:
> > Make the archive available via FTP:
>
> Convenient but the management of "accounts" and S/Key or PGP keys
> could be a real logistic nightmare.
>
> Have you considered putting the archive on CDrom and shipping that
> upon receipt of a copy of the license? Naturally there would be
> a modest fee for the media and shipping.
>
> Probably would want a "mirror" shipping office in the US.
>
> The reason I asked the "what will most folks want" question earlier
> was that perhaps folks only want a handful or a couple pieces. CDrom
> writing is extremely simple (I think FreeBSD makes it harder or more
> complex than other systems though) - perhaps folks could, with the
> request for a CD specify which parts they want and a "custom" CD
> could be created.
>
> This approach does have its own set of problems but it does do away
> with network snooping, outages and breakins. The archive could be
> offline or encrypted with a key known only to you - if you needed to
> make something available you could decrypt a copy and make it available
> for a small timewindow.
>
> I know I'm planning on creating a few CDs to safeguard the stuff I've
> obtained so far - good (and cheap) protection against disk crashes
> and unreadable backup tapes.
>
> A variation on this scheme would be to master a CD with everything
> on it and let SCO send the CD out along with the license when
> payment is received. Hmmmm - I kinda like this the more I think
> about it. Might even get some nice artwork (the BSD 'imp'?) on
> the cover. I'm sure SCO gets a real good rate at the CD pressing
> plant so the media cost would be lower than an individual doing it
> on a CDwriter.
> Perhaps the online/FTP archive could be a backup or secondary
> means of distribution - if someone convinces you (or sends a copy
> of the license) they have the license but lost the media, etc you
> could set up a PGP encrypted account for them.
> Cheers.
> Steven
Yes, I'd thought about cutting a CD directly from the current archive,
and certainly having someone (SCO, me?) distribute files on CD would
make the administration a lot easier. I guess license holders could
buy `upgrade CDs' if the archive changes.
If SCO come to the src license party, I certainly will ask them about
pressing CDs and distributing them as part of the license sale.
Thanks for the input Steven!
Warren
In atricle by Neil Johnson:
> Unfortunately I cannot justify calling sources for man pages "object code".
> Redistributing the man pages may be in the spirit of SCO's agreement, but
> is not allowed in the agreement. I do not think they should be added to the
> distribution without SCO's permission.
>
> Finally a disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, this is just my understanding of
> the licence, for which I give SCO my thanks.
> Neil
THat was my impression too, Neil. I was being hopeful (as always). We do
need to talk with SCO (via Bob Supnik?) to ensure we have SCO's permission
first.
Thanks!
Warren
>From Michael Engel <engel(a)unix-ag.uni-siegen.de> Thu Jan 23 10:49:20 1997
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From: Michael Engel <engel(a)unix-ag.uni-siegen.de>
Message-Id: <199701230049.BAA21049(a)vespa.unix-ag.uni-siegen.de>
Subject: Re: 7th Edition on a real PDP-11/23+ (fwd)
To: wkt(a)csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 1997 01:49:20 +0100 (MET)
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
In-Reply-To: <9701222201.AA22095@dolphin> from "Warren Toomey" at Jan 23, 97 09:01:23 am
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> > Warren,
> >
> > I'm not sure if the PUPS members would be interested, but I have
> > successfully been able to run the 7th Edition RL02 image that accompanies
> > Bob Supniks emulator on a real PDP-11/23+.Jim Carpenter (jimc(a)zach1.tiac.net)
> > deserves a special thanks for helping me work out a few problems in bringing
> > it up. If any other members of the group are interested in doing the same I
> > would be happy to help.
>
> Bob, I'm cc'ing this reply to the mailing list so that the others will
> get a copy.
Great ! Finally gotta dig out that old RL02 drive ... How did you manage
to get the image onto the RL02 ?
> Secondly, I'm unsure of the copyright/legal status of the man pages.
> It would be good if they could be released publically. I might ask Bob
> Supnik if he has any ideas.
Some time ago, the 7th Edition man pages were available on
http://plan9.att.com. This machine currently seems to be down, so I can't
verify if the man pages are still there.
regards,
Michael Engel (engel(a)unix-ag.uni-siegen.de)
>From "Bob Armstrong" <bob(a)poco-adagio.santa-clara.ca.us> Thu Jan 23 15:20:45 1997
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From: "Bob Armstrong" <bob(a)poco-adagio.santa-clara.ca.us>
Subject: RE: 7th Edition on a real PDP-11/23+
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
X-VMS-Mail-To: uucp%"oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au"
>Bob, firstly if you can write down the details of how you got the
>image installed & running on the 23+, and email it to the mailing list
>(oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au) that'd be great, as I archive the mail.
It was actually quite simple. Bob Supnik's RL02 file is simply a byte
for byte dump of a pack. That is, it's just sector 0, head 0, cylinder 0
followed by sector 1, head 0, cylinder 0, ... then all the sectors of
head 1, cylinder 0, then cylinder 1, etc. There are no overhead bytes
in the file an no interleaving is used. RL02s have 40 sectors of 256
bytes each per track, two heads, and 512 cylinders for a total 10240K bytes
per disk (which happens to be exactly the size of Bob's RL02 file :-)
You want to be careful about bad sectors, since RL02s do bad block
replacement at the device driver level. If your pack has any bad sectors
that aren't at exactly the same spot as bad sectors on Bob's original
pack (not very likely!), then this isn't going to work. Fortunately
error free RL02 packs are relatively easy to come by.
Anyway, since the only other RL02 that I have access to is on a VMS
system, I had to write a little program for VMS to load the disk using
physical I/O. I'd be happy to make this program available if anyone
wants it.
Once you have the pack loaded, you can just mount it on a 11/23 and use
the RL02 hardware boostrap. The Unix boot will start and print a "@" for
a prompt. Reply by entering "unix" and carriage return, and you'll see
"mem=205376" followed by "SINGLE USER LOGIN:". Enter ^Z and Unix will
start timesharing, then you can login in using root with the password "pdp".
I had two problems in this process. First, I didn't know about the
Unix bootstrap program (I'm afraid I've never used Bob's emulator!), and
when I saw the "@" I just blindly assumed I'd been dumped back into ODT.
Fortunately Jim Carpenter was kind enough to educate me about this.
Second, Unix would hang up as soon as I started timesharing. This
turned out to be because my LTC in the 11/23 wasn't working, which doesn't
bother RT11 at all but it does hang Unix. After I repaired the hardware
everything ran fine.
If someone has a PDP-11 with a RL02 drive and no way to load V7 on a
pack, I am willing to do it if you send me a blank RL02. I believe the
SCO license allows this so long as:
1) I don't charge for the service
2) You certify that it is for non-commerical use
3) I include a printed copy of SCO's license
Note that this kernel supports only RL02 drives, so unless your -11
has a RL02 drive this system won't work. RD5x and RA8x drives won't do.
A similar procedure would probably work with the RK05 images, but I
don't have the hardware to try.
>Finally, many of the members of the PUPS mail list are covered by
>source code licenses, so if you can tell us what device you require,
I have a 11/23, DLV11J (4 lines), RL02/RLV11, TU58 (on one of the
DLV11 ports), RX02/RXV21, and a TSV05 9-track tape. The TSV05 is
TS11 compatible, and I'd especially like to have support for it.
Bob's kernel supports MASSBUS tapes, but not a TS11.
>I'm sure someone can build a kernel for you. I wonder if it's legal to
>ship a kernel which has device drivers not in Bob Supnik's disk image?!
SCO's license seems to cover all PDP-11 binaries for 7th Edition Unix,
and it doesn't seem to say anything about their origin. Of course,
I'm not a lawyer either.
Bob
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au> Tue Feb 11 15:38:53 1997
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Tue, 11 Feb 1997 16:38:53 +1100 (EST)
Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 16:38:53 +1100 (EST)
From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199702110538.QAA08050(a)csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au>
To: moffen(a)ix.netcom.com
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Subject: Re: PDP-11
[Mike is taking over a sysadmin job for a UNIX PDP-11.
He hasn't seen one before. Can someone help!]
> Thanks for the response. I am told that it's running unix. I start the
> job the end of this week. The person I am replacing will be fired the
> day I start. So, I have never seen their computer room, and will not
> have any passwords or other info. It is critical that I gain control of
> the system and prevent that person from getting into the system. Any
> suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated.
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Mike Offenberg
> moffen(a)ix.netcom.com
Ok, I'd try to chat with the person before they leave! At least to get the
root password.
I am cc'ing this email to a group of PDP-11 Unix users who may be able to
help you out. I'd guess it's a 6th or 7th Edition UNIX, or a 2BSD system.
What you really need to know is:
+ how to get a root login on the system
+ how to change the root password
+ how to reboot the system properly
If the person leaves root logged in on the console, at least you can
type passwd and change the root password. If they haven't, then there
is no easy way of getting a root login to change the password, except
for rebooting the system.
Rebooting depends on what PDP-11 you've got there. If you can find out,
someone here should be able to explain how to boot into single-user mode,
where you have a root prompt and can change the root password and then
go to multi-user mode.
I'll try to get the basic maintenance manuals for these old UNIX systems
put into ASCII and email them to you.
Cheers,
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Tue Apr 29 15:11:09 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199704290511.PAA10537(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: PUPS Mailing list
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 15:11:09 +1000 (EST)
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Hi, this is just a mailout to the PDP-11 Unix Preservation Society mailing
list, as I've just added half a dozen addresses & I thought it would be a
good idea to check that all the old & new addresses are valid. If you want
off, please email me back!
Looks like Bob Supnik's emulators have sparked a bit of interest in these
old systems. Welcome to the new users of PDP-11 Unix!
Cheers,
Warren wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Jun 4 11:33:19 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199706040133.LAA00384(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: CSR/vector calculator for the archives (fwd)
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 11:33:19 +1000 (EST)
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----- Forwarded message from Tom I Helbekkmo -----
To: wkt(a)csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
From: Tom I Helbekkmo <tih(a)nhh.no>
Subject: CSR/vector calculator for the archives
Hi, Warren!
I've written a CSR and vector calculator, based on VMS documentation
and comparison tested against VMS SYSGEN. For want of a better name,
I'm simply calling the program 'sysgen' -- this shows its heritage, at
least... :-)
This should be useful to PDP (and VAX) users who don't have a VMS
system handy, and would like to configure their systems according to
DEC standard. Would you add it to the PUPS archives and send out an
announcement to the mailing list, please?
Thanks!
-tih
----- End of forwarded message from Tom I Helbekkmo -----
I assume this runs on any box with a C compiler. I've stashed it in the
archive in the Progams section. If you don't have a Unix license, let me know
& I'll email it to you.
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Thu Jun 26 09:54:27 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199706252354.JAA04546(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: No progress on PDP-11 Unix source licenses, ideas?
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Thu, 26 Jun 1997 09:54:27 +1000 (EST)
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Dear PDP-11 Unix people,
I'm emailing you because I haven't done much in the last few months about
encouraging SCO to sell source licenses for PDP-11 UNIX, and I think it's
time we try a new tack.
The person I've been negotiating with a SCO is Dion Johnson, dionj(a)sco.com.
I pestered him a lot last year and so perhaps I've worn out my welcome with
him. So I'd like to suggest another approach or two.
Perhaps another person interested in PDP-11 UNIX source licenses can try
talking with Dion or other people at SCO? Any volunteers? Steven Schultz?
Bob Supnik? Alternatively, if nobody comes forward, we could all email Dion
expressing our desires for sources licenses for these old UNIX versions.
Looking at the survey I've been conducting at
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/, at least 130 people are interested in
source licenses, and the general consensus is:
No resale of license is acceptable
No source redistribution is acceptable
50/50 split on single-user-only licenses
No commercial usage is acceptable
Full source code is preferable
Main UNIXes to be covered are 5th,6th,7th Edition and 2BSD.
Cost of license no more than US$200, max.
After reviewing the email from Dion, I'd add another condition which
would make SCO happy:
Source license adequately protects SCO's intellectual property,
in their view.
Anyway, please email your suggestions on what we should do to the PUPS
mailing list (oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au) or to me. I think the single
person approach is better than flooding Dion with email. Maybe we can sign
an email petition and deliver that to a number of people at SCO?
Thanks in advance for your input!
Warren wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Fri Jun 27 11:24:14 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199706270124.LAA06719(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Petition to SCO for licenses
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Fri, 27 Jun 1997 11:24:14 +1000 (EST)
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Dear PDP-11 UNIX people,
The small response to my suggestions about lobbying SCO for source
licenses brought some volunteers for the cause, and a preference for a
single petition to SCO rather than mail-bombing :-) If you didn't respond,
please let me know what you think & if you're willing to help out.
I've written a draft petition, which is attached below, and is also
available (with some hyperlinks) at
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/petition.html
Is there anything in the draft you disagree with, or wish to change?
Please let me know!!
Warren
The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
Dear Sirs/Madams,
We, the undersigned, are a group of people who are interested in obtaining
source code and binary copies of the versions of UNIX that ran on the PDP-11
range of computers from Digital Equipment Corporation. We would like to
have copies of these versions of UNIX because:
+ they are of great historical importance, and/or
+ we personally own PDP-11 computers on which these systems will run.
The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc. owns the copyright to these very old versions
of UNIX. We understand and appreciate that SCO wishes to protect their
intellectual property within, and ownership of, these versions of UNIX.
Therefore, we wish to petition SCO to make available source code and binary
licenses of these versions of UNIX so that:
+ we can legally own source code and binaries for PDP-11 UNIXes, and
+ SCO's copyright and intellectual property is protected.
We would be happy to purchase and be legally bound by a source code and
binary license for PDP-11 UNIXes that meets SCO's requirements, as long as:
+ the license covers the entire distributions (source code, binaries
and documentation) of the following versions of UNIX:
- 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th Edition UNIX
- 32V UNIX
- PWB/UNIX
- those portions of all 2BSD releases which are derived
from UNIX source code
+ we have the right to make changes to the source code of the
above versions of UNIX
+ we have the right to distribute our changes to other people who
have signed and agreed to the source code and binary license for
PDP-11 UNIXes
+ we have the right to install UNIX binaries on PDP-11 hardware
and PDP-11 emulating software
+ we have the right to allow other people to use the UNIX binaries
on such an installation
Note that the latter is already permitted, given SCO's binary license agreement
for 5th, 6th and 7th Edition UNIX. We would also be happy with the following
conditions imposed in the source code and binary license for PDP-11 UNIXes:
+ no resale of the license is permitted
+ source code covered by the license cannot be distributed or
disclosed to people not covered by the license
+ no commercial usage of the source code or binaries is permitted
+ SCO is not required to include copies of any source code, binaries
or documentation with the source code and binary license for PDP-11
UNIXes
On a recent survey of people interested in such a license (see
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/) over 120 people responded. Most of
the respondents would agree to a license with the conditions and limitations
outlined above, if the cost of such a license was less than US$200.
We urge you to consider
+ the historical significance of the UNIX operating system,
+ that the PDP-11 versions of UNIX are essentially obsolete,
+ that superior UNIX-like operating systems, libraries and
applications are freely available in source code form,
+ that the source code to 6th Edition UNIX is publically available
in printed form (Lion's Commentary on 6th Edition UNIX, Peer to
Peer Communications, Inc.)
and make personal-use non-disclosure source code and binaries licenses
for PDP-11 UNIXes available at a price which we can afford as individuals.
The UNIX community has played an extremely important role in the development
and success of the UNIX operating system. The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc., as
owners of the UNIX operating system source, would be repaying the UNIX
community in some measure by providing source licenses for these old versions
of UNIX. Although you would not profit greatly from the licenses, you would
earn the respect and appreciation from many people who helped make UNIX what
it is today.
Thank you for your time. Your response to our petition will be appreciated,
and can be sent via Internet e-mail to Warren Toomey wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au.
Sincerely yours,
The undersigned
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Jul 2 10:21:15 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199707020021.KAA16859(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Re: PDP11
To: crr(a)gil.com.au
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 10:21:15 +1000 (EST)
Cc: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
In-Reply-To: <199707020013.KAA08108(a)iccu6.ipswich.gil.com.au> from "crr(a)gil.com.au" at "Jul 2, 97 10:13:49 am"
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In atricle by crr(a)gil.com.au:
> Hello Warren,
>
> Just a short note to introduce myself, Colin Riddel is my name,
> I have just
> saved from the scrap heap a PDP11 / 34 with 2 RK5 drives
> and about 20 disks.. unfortunately the former owners of the system
> wiped all contents from the disks. I would like to be able to
> get a copy of UNIX for the PDP11, then fully restore the machime
> I would apreciate any information that you can give me on
> obtaining and setting up PDP unix on the beast
>
> I am a member of HUMBUG (home Unix machine Brisbane user group )
> and one of the system administrators at Global Info-Links (an ISP in
> Ipswich Qld)
> Colin Riddel
Hi Colin, I saw you sign the petition, thanks. The problem is how to load the
software onto the box! There are RK05 disk images of UNIX (v6 and v7) at
ftp://minnie.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11-sims/Supnik_2.2d/
But how do we get them into the box? Do you have any boot disks for any OS
(RSX, RT-11)? What about tape drives?
I'll pass this onto our mailing list, maybe some more knowledgeable readers
will be able to answer you. Alternatively, posting this to vmsnet.pdp-11
should get you an answers.
Ciao,
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Jul 2 12:00:05 1997
Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158])
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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 12:00:05 +1000 (EST)
From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199707020200.MAA17575(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
To: unixarc(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au
Subject: Petition SCO for PDP-11 UNIX Source Licenses
Hello,
You may have received email from me last week asking for ideas about
lobbying SCO to make source licenses for PDP-11 UNIXes available. The feedback
from the email was in favour of creating a petition which we would present to
SCO. I mailed a draft petition to many of you and again got a favourable
response.
Therefore, I've set up a WWW petition for PDP-11 UNIX source licenses at
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/petition.html.
PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION!!! if you agree with the petition.
PLEASE GET OTHER PEOPLE TO SIGN TOO!!! We need as many signatures as we can
get. Pass the word around to other interested people you know of.
If you filled in the PDP-11 UNIX source code survey on the same WWW server,
your name has been automatically put on the petition, unless you disagreed
with the petition's contents. Please email me if you want your name removed.
You can re-sign the petition to add your Full Name; I'll tidy it up later.
I'd like to get well over 100 names on the petition before I pass it to SCO.
If you have contacts at SCO who we could send the petition, please email me!
If you'd like to be put on a mailing list to be kept informed of the petition's
progress, also email me.
Hopefully, we will get a result from SCO.
Thanks again,
Warren Toomey wkt(a)cs.adfa.oz.au
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Jul 2 12:05:23 1997
Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158])
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199707020205.MAA17606(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: PDP UNIX Src License Petition
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 12:05:23 +1000 (EST)
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Apologies if you've already got word of this; I've lost track of who I have
& haven't emailed. There is a petition to sign to convince SCO to make
Unix source licenses available at
http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/petition.html
160 signatures so far, about 120 culled from the survey I was running and
40 in the past 48 hours. Please sign if you want SCO to make licenses
available!
Informal feedback from SCO is good; Dion Johnson there thinks it looks
reasonable & he will be our advocate at SCO.
Thanks,
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Jul 16 09:38:59 1997
Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158])
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199707152339.JAA01410(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: Another Old PDP-11 UNIX Tape
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 1997 09:38:59 +1000 (EST)
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Hi all,
I've just tracked down another old tape with PDP-11 Unix stuff on it.
It's in the UK. Anybody there care to chat with George & extract the bits
from the tape so we can put it in the archive?
----- Forwarded message from George Coulouris -----
To: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
From: George Coulouris <George.Coulouris(a)dcs.qmw.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: PDP-11 UNIX
Warren,
I've had a 9-track tape reel in my bottom drawer for about 15 years. I no
longer remember what is on it! It may contain the source of 'em' and a few
other utilities that I wrote in the '70s. Unfortunately I have no
convenient way to read it. If you are interested, I could try to find
someone with a 9-track reel drive, or if you have one I could just
send the tape to you. I'd be happy to liase with anyone who is willing to
have a go at reading the tape.
George
----- End of forwarded message from George Coulouris -----
Also, the source code petition has now got 290 signatures. I haven't heard
anything from SCO since I passed it to them formally, except that they had
received it and it was being passed to `the right people'. I'll keep updating
the status page, hyperlinked to the petition itself, as things happen.
The petition's at http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/petition.html. Quite a
number of well-known people have signed. Both Andy Tan(n)enbaums, Steven
Schultz, Richard Tobin, Bill Joy, Henry Spencer, Neil Groundwater, Dave
Presotto, Andrew Hume, Peter Collinson, Greg Rose, Brian Redman, Peter
Honeyman, Megan Gentry, Jim McKie, Margo Seltzer, John Mashey, Peter Salus,
Ozalp Babaoglu, Keith Bostic, George Coulouris etc. Plus all the other
individuals who have shown support.
Cheers,
Warren
>From Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Wed Jul 23 13:36:12 1997
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From: Warren Toomey <wkt(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Message-Id: <199707230336.NAA01232(a)henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>
Subject: New PDP-11 UNIX Archive Additions
To: oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation)
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 13:36:12 +1000 (EST)
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All,
I've just received a couple of _huge_ tarballs from Keith Bostic
with the following PDP-11 UNIX stuff:
1BSD
2.10BSD
2.79BSD
2.8BSD
2.9BSD
2BSD First 2BSD tape.
3BSD First 3BSD tape.
pascal.2.0 Pascal distribution
pascal.2.10 Pascal distribution
32V
Documentors WorkBench.
pdp.archive ???
pwb 3 slightly different & incomplete versions
v6 6th Edition
v6.compat ???
v7 7th Edition
v7add The "40 changes" tape.
v7m Follow-on release to V7
Due to space considerations (& a lack of time), I haven't been able to
extract anything into the licensed UNIX archive that I run on henry. I'd
also like to try and remove duplicates where possible.
If you're interested in a particular thing from the tarballs, please email
me and I'll extract the relevant sections.
Also: 300+ signatures on the PDP-11 UNIX src license petition. I just sent
a reminder email to SCO to see what they're doing with it.
Cheers,
Warren
> From: "Bob Armstrong" <bob(a)poco-adagio.santa-clara.ca.us>
> Subject: 7th Edition on a real PDP-11/23+
> To: wkt(a)csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au
>
> Warren,
>
> I'm not sure if the PUPS members would be interested, but I have
> successfully been able to run the 7th Edition RL02 image that accompanies
> Bob Supniks emulator on a real PDP-11/23+.Jim Carpenter (jimc(a)zach1.tiac.net)
> deserves a special thanks for helping me work out a few problems in bringing
> it up. If any other members of the group are interested in doing the same I
> would be happy to help.
Bob, I'm cc'ing this reply to the mailing list so that the others will
get a copy.
> As I understand the terms of the SCO license, this should be perfectly
> legal so long as it is for non-commerical purposes. There doesn't seem
> to be anything in the license that limits me to using an emulator.
> Please correct me if you disagree.
As far as I can see, you can do anything with the disk image as long as
it's non-commercial. So I'm sure that it's perfectly legal.
>
> Performance is suprisingly good, especially considering that the 11/23+
> was no speed demon even by old PDP standards. And it's amazing - the
> whole Unix system fits on a 10Mb pack with about 3.5Mb free!
>
> The contents of this disk image seem to be pretty limited, and I'm
> interested in knowing if any of the missing components (e.g. man pages!!)
> are available anywhere. I'm also interested to know if there are any V7
> kernels available with more devices installed. I've got a lot of hardware
> on my 11/23, especially a TSV05 but also a RX02 and TU58, that this system
> can't use.
> Bob Armstrong
Bob, firstly if you can write down the details of how you got the
image installed & running on the 23+, and email it to the mailing list
(oldunix(a)minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au) that'd be great, as I archive the mail.
Secondly, I'm unsure of the copyright/legal status of the man pages.
It would be good if they could be released publically. I might ask Bob
Supnik if he has any ideas.
Finally, many of the members of the PUPS mail list are covered by
source code licenses, so if you can tell us what device you require,
I'm sure someone can build a kernel for you. I wonder if it's legal to
ship a kernel which has device drivers not in Bob Supnik's disk image?!
Hope so!
Cheers,
Warren
